Ladies, you don't have to settle for this.....
These are some of the recent comments made about Lebron James GF on a recent sports blog in reaction to the news that she had, had another baby for him without a ring on her finger......
kt said....
ok here go again no wedding invitation but yet she sitting her with not 1 but 2 kids..come on when are gonna do better then this my sista's...marriage b4 the kids was the way i was raised but hey time is difinitly changing when you got these women out here that will do anything to trap a man...think more of yourself at least get a ring honey...
ok here go again no wedding invitation but yet she sitting her with not 1 but 2 kids..come on when are gonna do better then this my sista's...marriage b4 the kids was the way i was raised but hey time is difinitly changing when you got these women out here that will do anything to trap a man...think more of yourself at least get a ring honey...
BGB said....
And she will KEEP waiting for that ring. He already got the cow now, I
Again some women think that , "Oh I got his kids, he ain't going to leave me!" Please get real! How many kids will it take for you to see how stupid you are!
If the word "STUPID" is not stamped on her forehead, it should be. Just look at p.diddy and his miss wanta be wife.
And she will KEEP waiting for that ring. He already got the cow now, I
Again some women think that , "Oh I got his kids, he ain't going to leave me!" Please get real! How many kids will it take for you to see how stupid you are!
If the word "STUPID" is not stamped on her forehead, it should be. Just look at p.diddy and his miss wanta be wife.
Carly said...
why buy the cow...this is all black folks are doing...just F-ing & having kids...we have no family/morale values anymore...70% of black babies are born out of wedlock...we are pathetic people no wonder whites are laughing at us!
why buy the cow...this is all black folks are doing...just F-ing & having kids...we have no family/morale values anymore...70% of black babies are born out of wedlock...we are pathetic people no wonder whites are laughing at us!
lg said...
I guess Savannah says she might as well make babies because she can not seem to get down the aisle of matrimony.
I guess Savannah says she might as well make babies because she can not seem to get down the aisle of matrimony.
Ch. said...
I've said this in a former blog, and this is true. Besides, just saying we are committed, marriage says I care enough to protect you. What happens if something happens to LeBron tomorrow? What are Savaanah's rights? Does she have the right to say how he would be treated in a medical conditional? How he could be buried? I'm not killing the man off or putting any vibes in the air, I'm just saying in real life things happen, and if you don't have that contract (marriage license) then you don't have any rights. If she has a good relationship with the mother, then maybe the mother will listen to what she has to say.Women, let's stop selling ourselves short. Look further down the road, and realize that love is more than marriage, it's a protection and a contract.
DN said....
Why oh why do these stupid women keep having kids without being married. It is God's calling to be married before you have kids. And if Lebron was any kind of man and really loved her, he would do the right thing. And besides, these are the messages that they are sending out to young people who look up to them, that it's O.K. to have kids without being married. That's one reason why you are seeing soo many OOW births. And if his reasoning for not marrying her is because he's trying to protect his net worth if their relationship ended; I've got news for him. If she gets a good lawyer, she can still get half!
These are some of the comments made by people to the recent news of lebron James new son. He and his long time girlfriend have just welcomed baby number 2 into the fold. And even though she is young beautiful and seeming sweet, he is making no moves toward marriage. Ladies, you must understand that when it comes to marriage, the women who get the rings are the ones who will not continue the relationship without one. All men are very sexual creatures and will have sex even with women they do not much care for if it is offered. You can never use sex or children to get a ring because by the time you have children for a man, you have already played your best hand. You must find out his position on marriage and family before any sex ever occurs. Afterwards, it is way too late! We as bw must stop playing baby-mamma and play WIFE! It must be NON-NEGOCIABLE! You must make it clear from the start that you are not a plaything, that he can discard when he is tired of it. The stage must be set from the inception of the relationship and maintained thoughout. How do you set the stage? You make it clear you will not be treated like a hoochie or a hit and quit girl. You demand respect and make him watch his ps and qs. You are setting the tone right from the start, and once you set it, it is extremely hard to break it, so it is imperative that you set it right. If he is disrespectful, cease contact immediately. Men do not respond to whining or moaning, they respond to no contact. Expect to be treated like a lady and make it clear you will not tolerate anything less. Women who settle for being treated like baby mammas are likely to become just that... Any wife will tell you "honey, he knew I was not about to have kids for a man I wasn't even married to!" In other words, she set the tone, and he put or gave up. Ladies we owe it to our children to establish strong families with real fathers and marriage may not be perfect, but it is pretty much the best system we have. It enables you to have:
a. His name
b. Share in his financial resources, (his job, his pension, his retirement etc)
c. Some Security in event of his death
d. Some say in event of medical crisis
e. Financial, and marital resources fo the children you have
e. Financial, and marital resources fo the children you have
f. Some say in how the marital assets are dispensed
g. The respect of letting the world know, he loved you enough to marry you etc. Picture a man introducing his dream girl. Do you thnk for one minute he wants to turn to people and say -"this is my baby-mamma"? No, when a man introduces his dream girl, he wants to turn to friends and strangers alike, and proudly declare "This is my wife"
Like I said, marriage is not perfect but it is a hell of a lot better than a ringless, committmentless relationship with nothing to show for it, except sweet empty words. Ladies you deserve the best and so do your children-remember that...
posted by Taylor-Sara @ 7:57 PM
69 Comments
69 Comments:
Sara,
I have a girlfriend who purposely got pregnant because she was a woman of a certain age and wanted to have a baby. Her so called man did not really want to have a baby. Now she chases him around for his crumbs.
It is up to our sisters to protect themselves but they also need to make smart decisions (such as your post suggests) when choosing a husband and/or the father of your baby. It is one of the most important decisions women make.
I have to admit that I do tell the younger males in my family to wear protection because some of these young sisters will get pregnant by them (whether he wants a child or not) then they will chase him down for his money.
Yes, I know that it takes two to tangle but it is the women who ends up struggling, raising the child alone and becomes a negative black female statistic.
I STAY on the pill and take it faithfully (everyday at 10pm) because I do not want to have kids outside of marriage!! I tell bp that and they look at me like im crazy... but guess who has the happy-oow-baby-free life.... ME :)
Ortho Cyclen is my best friend!! LOL
Sara-everyone, have you guys been this hilarious site...
http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.wordpress.com/
AMAZING, to put a smile on your faces
Sorry, forgot this..
Samples...
#8 Barack Obama — “Because white people are afraid that if they don’t like him that they will be called racist.”
#7 Diversity — “White people love ethnic diversity, but only as it relates to restaurants.”
Sorry, about posting that site first, because
Kim Porter-hummmm. OMG, Sean has 6 children, one born at the same time as your twins-which means he is not faithful to you and photographic proof that he slept with Sienna Miller, Penelope Cruz, and a model in Canada. She kills me, because people see Sean as some crusader or 'what a successful BM' is and this man has 6 children from three different woman. THIS SHAMES US!
But infidelity in the BC, it runs SO DEEP, I don't even know where to begin and now add that if 10 BW have babies are born tonight-7 will not have a father there at their birth and 5 of those 7 will never meet/or never have their father's in their lives-MY GOODNESS!
Yet I do question something psychological about the baby-momma situation in the BC, and I'm being completely honest with my own perspective and thoughts of this matter. When I think about the relations between BW, BM and family/marriage/fidelity. Is it that so many of us have watched our mothers/aunts lives and marriages-the men in our lives not have respect for marriage. So that it's a damned if you do/damned if you don't situation-that this new 'baby-momma-dum' is just a result of it?
What I'm asking is: Do some BW see having & raising children on their own or with limited expectation of Male involvement as "easy" compared to the prospects of finding a good man, getting him to marry you, and remain faithful to you? Which would explain this settling for this new best-we-can-get: A man, who is "a good father" and child-support?
I have my own thoughts, but I want to see what the consensus is with ya'll.
I totally believe in marriage before children and black women valuing themselves.
That said, perhaps your message would appear more consistent if you removed the picture of the very pregnant, very unmarried Halle Berry (unless I missed the announcement of her engagement or marriage) from your side bar.
Yeah, I know you can, will, and should do as you want since it is your blog.
Just thought I'd point it out.
@Black Women First...I'm not surprised that black folks look at you funny for not wanting kids. They assume that that's you being 'selfish'. That is so stupid. Why am I being selfish for not bringing a child into the world. A child that I know I'm not ready for. Now what would be selfish is me having a kid and making everybody else pay for it. I always get a few weird looks and "really?!?!?" for when people find out that I'm a child-free, twenty-seven year old black woman.
Oh and another woman that's probably going to be waiting forever for a wedding ring is Lala, the chick who is dating Carmello "Stop Snitchin'" Anthony. He is a new can of worms all on his own.
yeah, I know halle is not married either, but I really cannot fault her. For one. she certainly has given marriage a try 2 times and been burned by Damaged men both times. (the first one tells her he no longer wants to be married and asks for a divorce because she had legal troubles, and the second one cheated on her with over 100 women claiming he had a sex addiction and then has the nerve to sue for millions even though they signed a prenup!The worst part is she now has to pay him 20.000 per month and had to buy this sorry, trifling lazy, cheating brother a 4million dollar house!!!) No, I don't agree with babies without marriage, but I certainly understand why halle is reluctant is marry..+ I love her to death so she stays up regardless....
I think Georgia is onto something.
Earlier generations of black women started divorcing in record numbers in the 1970s onwards, and many young people grew up seeing parents divorcing, dating others, having kids by others after the divorce, and thus, there is great cynicism about marriage. Why else the article, "Marriage is for White People?" If no one wants marriage because they can't see the benefit in an institution which only confers drama, they want the kids only.
Perhaps women who grew up in stable families where the parents were married, or who are the children of divorced parents who experienced pain because of that, are the ones who value marriage the most and make sure their partners follow that script.
But no woman should ever hope to trap a man through pregnancy, because the social support for encouraging men to marry the mothers of their out of wedlock children, is not always there.
Now accidents do happen, even though there are woman who might try to "trap" a man, an accidental pregnancy is what will provide a true test of a man's character: his response, to commit, or hang around until he is ready to "step?"
REALLY, I didn't know that Halle lost her case against Eric-is she really paying him Man-amony ? MF! wow-Halle is an PRIME example of the BW who was LOYAL to the BM. 80% deaf in one ear, 2 divorces, she is definitely a sister who is an exception to the rule-she's paid her due in full.
I can't wait for that beautiful baby to be born, it's going to be gorgeous!
But as for babies before marriage, children are not an assured in-marriage-anymore with an man. So I say-proceed with caution to any woman contemplating having a baby. You should want a child yourself first-but then I've given my position of my own question.
When I'm ready, I am more then prepared to have 'my own children' despite what my romantic life look likes. Motherhood, sadly, is a completely sphere from wifehood in my mind.
Amen Sara! Tell the truth...Some people may look at me sideways for being 32, single and without children...I want THE BEST life for my future generation...Not damage, crumbs and broken families...Bottom Line!
BWDB http://thecwexperience.wordpress.com
I do mean that Pioneer V. Woman...
But I also meant the opposite situation as well, my mother and aunts are all married, but I have no faith in marriage because all the Dufresne men have had affairs-and it breaks my heart to say it, but I did the research-but NOT ONE of the men in my family tree was ever faithful to his wife.
My father included, and his father was a breeder, as my father is was the eldest of 20. (10 of birth, 10 step/half-but we're Caribbean-so the concept of step/half siblings doesn't exist really, I've found.) I look at this trend in the BC and then look at the divorce rate in the WC-50%, and I wonder if this new trend is because we are not taught what a 'marriage' looks like because we...
1.) Have seen that being married, doesn't guarantee the assurances a marriage is suppose to come with or
2.) We've never seen a working marriage
I hate how some are quick to believe that we are not taught through the images of experience in our lives-our parents lives, the way we observed them living/going through their lives and how well they acted in their day-to-day interactions with family, co-workers, etc.
But then I look to Africa, and the trend (Motherhood over Wifehood) seems a result of this. Is the BW seeing having her own children-motherhood, more valid an existence then holding out for a ring? Are we talking about a new base problem that could stop BW from looking a good WM and say-well if this doesn't work out, at least I'll have my kids?
Thank you!!! I totally AGREE!!!
Georgia, to your question about halle is yes and no. Yes she did lose because she has to pay him 20.000 per month for life! and the 4 million dollar house! so he can cheat on her with too many women to count and come away laughing about it (the asshole) but no, he did not get all he wanted because he sued for millions! I just cannot beleive his nerve, he cheated on her and sues her! And they call black women gold diggers! If he is not the male equivolent of a gold digger I don't know who the hell is!
I think when it comes to an issue like this it is case by case. Most people feel if a woman has that ring on her finger then this provides stability, I can agree and disagree with this. I would agree for some of the reasons that some of you have brought up already, but at the same time I can disagree. I have been around woman who have went to school, did the right thing and waited to find the right man to have kids with after marriage; however sometimes it can take a decade to find the right man. I've seen some women do the right thing and wait and hit the age of 40, by this time the clock is really ticking and the chances of having their own child is slim to none. What do we say to those women who are married and then have children with their so called dream man to then up and leave for the nanny or another woman/man. Some women become single moms for different reasons. Me personally I love my bi-racial child and I do admitt being a single mom is a challenge and I'm 27 noe but I had him at 20, I'm happy I had a child young I can keep up with him I never wanted to be an old,old mother. When my son gets in his 20's I'll still be young and vibrant in my early 40's, of course I'll be all done with school and hope to have met that right person to have more kids with, but if not I can still say I've raised my own child, something speacial that came from me and no one else. I see so many women stay trapped into a loveless marriage, in order to keep the front up and keep their children in a two parent home. These types of women are dying inside and to me I think it is WEAK to stay in a loveless relationship for that reason. Just keep in mind folks children are a gift and some women can't have any at all or wait to late to have them, that has to hurt, also for the women who are in that situation don't hate on a woman who produced a child/gift even if she's single. I can't tell you how many women I have met that wish they can have a kid. Now I don't believe in going out and having 10 kids by 10 different men especially if your finances aren't right on their own and for the celebrity baby mommas all I can say is at least their kids are provided for whether their married or not.
This may sound brutal but I believe in aligning oneself with communities that respect marriage. Asians, Indians, Arabs, Latin and even traditional Europeans are big believers in marriage as an honorable pursuit. If you're a black woman and the men in your community don't believe in any kind of sound commitment it's time to look outside. Kim Porter is the perfect example of what not to do.
I don't think anyone is questioning that children are ALWAYS a gift regardless of how they come, I think the question is whether its wise to have them out of wedlock, it certainly can be a double edged sword because it may take a long time to meet Mr right and you certainly don't want to lose the chance to have this special blessing, but so many kids end up bitter and angry because theire is no father around, I just wonder how fair it is to the child to bring them into such tenuous circumstances of just a flimsy relationship (which prob. won't last, little chance of a ring and then a father gone in the wind...)
With regard to Halle Berry, at least she wont be chasing the "baby daddy" around for money. That baby will be taken care of regardless.
personally (and this is just my opinion, i'm not attacking you) i think you're putting marriage on too high of a pedestal. marriage does not automatically mean that a couple will end up happy.
as far as i know, Lebron James and his girlfriend (who i don't know personally) are happy together and are fine with their current situation. and as far as i can tell, Lebron isn't using her or is abusive in anyway.
but there is a difference between a situation like that and someone using someone else. in that case, the person being used should kick the other person to the curb, and quick. but a couple can be happy together without getting married.
also, if one person in a relationship has no interest in getting married, they should be upfront and honest about it, and not lead the other person on. if they do that, then the latter person know what they're getting into, and has no right to complain.
anyway, sara these are just my thoughts. i love your blog! keep it going.
Eric, I beg to differ with you but I feel that black women DESERVE the Whole fairly tale not just the 'at least I have part of a man part. We deserve the ring, the home the babies the TITLE the name and the right to call ourselves Ms whatever! No one is telling white women 'well girl, at least you got some part of him, his babies and he ain't hitting you, girl stop being greedy. I beg to differ with you but we deserve every damn thing a white woman would EXPECT! and just because he is not abusive does not mean she should settle for being his baby mamma instead of his damn WIFE! How do you think she feels when she has to introduce him to people in the street at church or wherever and she cannot say "this is my husband" I know deep inside it must be eating at her. When she was in the hospital giving birth and Tiger Woods wife was in the hospital at the same time. The newspapers were gleefully reporting Tiger's lovely WIFE is here giving birth to their first child. Then they went on to say Oh, and lebron James baby's mamma is also giving birth! How the hell do you think that made her feel? I already said marriage is not an automatic ticket to happy ever after, but do you think being baby mamma instead of wifey is a more desirable choice? Imagine how she felt when the papers were saying this? She probably felt like Tiger loved that ww enough to marry her and give her his name, Lebron claims to love me but won't even discuss marriage, people are snickering behind my back....Nobody tells a white woman to settle for that shit, and neither should we!! Both puffy and Lebron should have done the right thing, especially with millions of young black kids looking up to them... but once again treating a sista like she's less than....
Sara-Taylor said...
"so many kids end up bitter and angry because theire is no father around, I just wonder how fair it is to the child to bring them into such tenuous circumstances of just a flimsy relationship"
Many of us who were in married homes are just as slighted, despite having a father around. When I look at my father's life-he was allowed to starve, and broke a vertebra of his back tripping on house-step because of his father's recklessness-and still committed his father's greatest sin.
How do we combat the after-effects and feelings in our our lives and our children lives?
Then I think of Kim Porter, I am drawn to something she said when she was asked about the fact that Puff had another kid while she was pregnant:
Kim Porter...
", “It’s not an original script. He’s not the first man who’s cheated. He’s not the first man who’s had a baby outside of his relationship. He’s not the originator of this. But at this point in my life – I have girls now – it’s a different program.”
“I would have preferred to find out from him because that’s a man,” she says. “I know it’s hard for anyone to say to their significant other, ‘I’ve gotten into some s— and I got a baby on the way.’ But men do get caught up in things; I’m not naive to that. Still, there’s a right and a wrong way to handle it. Because, most of all, we were friends. Even if I couldn’t have understood it as a woman, I would have understood it as a friend.”
First; I say what kind of delusional woman are you Kim, you DO have daughters now, but more importantly YOU HAVE SONS. The way you let their father treat you is the way they will believe is acceptable to treat women when they grow up. And your daughters will grow up believing the way their mother is treated is the way a 'husband' should treat his wife
UNTIL/UNLESS a woman makes it know what her placement and how will be treated in a relationship, your children will CONTINUE to follow the script!
BUT....Listen closely and you hear a woman who is stuck in a 'script' and-I don't think-'knows any better.' What's worse is, if she doesn't wake up, her children will repeat her mistakes.
When I think of myself--
I see myself going with what has presented itself as the 'optimum choice' that: when I'm ready to have a child, I will.
It would be nice if I had a man, that would be great, but even if I had one-the expectation I have of him is...............
This is a trust issue, but I acknowledge that, and am seeing the blocks it causes in my new relationship. For what I've seen does not encourage me, but security in the notion of 'Motherhood'-one day, I'll have my own kids and my own family-sounds EASY and wonderful to me.
"How do you think she feels when she has to introduce him to people in the street at church or wherever and she cannot say "this is my husband" I know deep inside it must be eating at her."
see, unless you know her personally, i wouldn't assume things like this. who knows what's she's feeling when he introduces her to anyone. i don't know, so i'm not going to assume one thing or the other.
Well, since I am a woman and you're not eric, I think I can imagine this feeling a lot better than you...She's young, she's beautiful and she's the mother of 2 children but she cannot call the man in her life her husband because EVERYBODY knows he's not, I think it's pretty easy to guess how she feels. Unless she has very low self esteem she will want the whole shabank not just part of it...
it's still pretty arrogant to assume what some one else is thinking or what they want. even more so if you base it on gender alone. i don't assume what every male on earth wants.
This is my last comment on this matter eric, and your last comment as well, I did not assume anything. I said I THINK IT WOULD BE PRETTY EASY TO GUESS HOW SHE FELT! Most women, (not all) want the same things from a man, his love,name, ring, children, trust etc....
Eric-
I think you're putting marriage on too high of a pedestal.
When I hear this, I think of hearing others say-"Not everyone believes in 'marriage.' That is actually not true-it has been found that a majority of people who say this actually don't want to get divorced and DO believe in marriage.
The hugest fallacy in society is the the inability to have something to count on-marriage-is quickly becoming one of these things individuals are not looking forward to-so you'll hear self-protective statements like, "while I don't even believe in marriage" translation: I don't want to get hurt.
Chloe-
This may sound brutal but I believe in aligning oneself with communities that respect marriage.
When you say this I think of an episode of "Family Guy." Stu-the baby wants to get out of his fake marriage and questions his friend Brian-the family dog-what would that make him if he just walked out on her.
Brain responds- A BLACK MAN, and I laughed.
Mind you, I was in a psych class, where as normal, I was the one of three bw there. But I have to tell you, I didn't shame anyone for laughing at that joke. It is becoming imperative for BW to call it like it is, so I completely AGREE with you Chloe.
This comment has been removed by the author.
I sorry too, but I take that very personally! I have never heard anyone in all my years on this earth ever tell a white woman to be satisfied with being a baby-mamma instead of a wife! But people are quick to tell a sista to settle for that shit! I will say once again. WE DESERVE EVERYTHING A WW WOULD EXPECT!
lol, glad you don't take things personally.
seriously, though, i do agree with you that if a woman is in a relationship, and WANTS to get married, and the man either keeps dodging it or keeps promising that they'll get married and they never do, then yes, there is no reason she should have to put up with that.
all i was trying to say was that marriage isn't always what it's cracked up to be. just because two people end up married, doesn't mean things will end up 'happily ever after' marriage is not a guarantee for happiness or long longevity in a relationship.
and don't worry, sara. i still love your blog.
"I have to find that "Family Guy" episode"
I don't think Sara is worried at all, Eric.
One of my girlfriends, who is white, is married to a black man. She has a dating history of preferring bm. Before she got married she was living with another bm. One day she was speaking to his sister on the telephone. His sister wanted to know when she was going to have kids with her brother since they've been together for over a year. My friend told her she is not having kids with him because they're not married. His sister thought she was crazy and then she said, which is the saddest part, 'I forgot you're white, that marriage stuff is a white thing. You're with a brotha now and need to forget all that.' Needless to say she got rid of the live in bf and is now married with two daughters.
I absolutely believe that AA blacks do settle for less and don't strive for excellence in interpersonal relationships. Of course marriage is not a guarantee, there are no guarantees in life except death and taxes. That's a poor reason for devaluing marriage. I don't blame Chloe at all for aligning herself with people who share her same values. That's why I got the hell out of the bc when I went off to college after high school. I have noticed in my travels around the world that non-AA blacks value marriage.
Best,
Jaz
Chloe, I totally salute and agree with what you stated - BW must align themselves with successful behaviors because successful behaviors breed successful people.
Regarding Eric, yes, it is possible for one woman to put herself in the shoes of another on issues of feelings concerning "womanly" issues. And women talk to each other, so I know and Sara knows what we women say to each other that we won't say to men or to the world in general about our feelings of hurt and abuse. I think a lot of men, particularly BM, are purposely in denial about the effect of their behavior on women and children, not because they don't know, but because they don't want to know or acknowledge reality. Acknowledging reality would force men to confront their behaviors and the consequences thereof, and would likely require a change in much of the self-indulgent and selfish behaviors that so many men exhibit in regard to their treatment of women and children. Men don't want to do this. So I think it's a cop-out to say that if the man doesn't want to get married and the woman knows this, she should not complain that he does not marry her. No - I think it's just as fair to say that if the man knows the woman wants to get married and he doesn't, then he should end the relationship and find a woman who does not want to get married. Only then can he claim to have acted with integrity. It's very clear to me that for a man to continue using a woman who he know wants marriage, who may even have his children so that now her options of leaving have been severely narrowed, that constitutes abuse. He is taking advantage of her feelings and their having OOW children to get what he wants and leave her without the protection of marriage. There is no integrity in such selfish, childish behavior. Such a man has clearly put himself first, to the detriment of his woman and his children.
And there is a real failure/denial in the bc to connect OOW births, and the behaviors that have caused them to proliferate, with the rate of failure that AA's are experiencing in various facets of life today in America. AA's want the success that others have, but we don't want to practice the discipline and other behaviors they did in order to achieve that success. We prefer to think that they got what they got JUST BECAUSE they are white or not black. All behaviors have consequences - good behaviors yield good consequences, while bad behaviors yield bad consequences. That truth is there for all to see with a 70% unmarried rate and a 70% OOW birth rate.
sandra, yes, if a man in a relationship doesn't want marriage and knows the woman does, he has an obligation to be honest with her and break it off. i never said he shouldn't.
and like i said, the woman shouldn't put up with that.
but keep in mind that not every situation is like that. and i'm not devaluing marriage at all. if and when i find the right woman, i would marry her in a heartbeat.
and i still feel and unless you know someone personally, there's no way you can absolutely know 100% what they want or what they're feeling.
Marriage may not be a ticket to happy ever after - but having children w/out a commitment from the father to be there and provide for them that is binding is a ticket to happy never after. This is because w/out a binding agreement the security of the children is not guaranteed long term and there is no recourse and the mother and father have failed to protect those children.
Granted some couples never marry i.e. Goldie and Kurt and Halle and Gabe but undoubtedly these women made sure the children of that union are taken care of now and in the future. Many women do not do that and happily settle for less and choose to struggle needlessly.
If both parties are not happy with the arrangement then there is a problem and - maybe I am biased but I cannot believe that these baby mamma's are happy with the struggle and the constant instability. These men can walk out anytime and to make sure they are taken care of these women always have to be on guard and planning which clearly is not their strong suit.
A woman makes herself vulnerable when she gets pregnant and continues to be vulnerable as long as she has children. Vulnerable as in capable of being hurt or put at a disadvantage. Men real men protect what they value and they protect the vulnerable - a man who values a woman will not put her at risk and will protect her because he cares. That is a non-negotiable.
If a man is not willing to be honorable about his intentions and wishes and honor the wishes and protect and safeguard the woman he is with then he does not deserve to be with her. This means safeguarding her mind body and soul.
A typical baby momma w/out Halle or Goldie's resources and partner support does not have peace of mind, a baby momma is subject to scorn and ridicule and undue financial hardship not to mention mental, physical and spiritual stress. This takes a toll on a persons spirit and it is needless.
V/r
Clarice
I would just like to say I'm not trying to keep up with any white women. From what I have observed you will find more white women to stay married/bonded into a loveless marriage than you would a black women. Just becasue we see so many white women married set up in a picket fence home does not mean it is all rosy. Like I have mentioned before you have so many women trapped into loveless marriages, because of the fear of being a "single mom", which I think are weak women. I do not look up to women like this, I look up to women who aren't afraid to take control of their life, and keep pushin, while raising their child or children alone if the relationship or marriage doesn't work. I have no respect for a women that will stay in order to be "Married". Can someone please tell me what the difference is if a child see their parents in a loveless marriage? To me that is far more damaging to a child. Their are probably a series of reasons that I don't agree with these type of women who do this. My mother was in the same situation and stayed with my abusive dad for us, the children. Because of this decision I never got the chance to know her, he ended up murdering her to then kill himself, who do you think this effected, me, my brother and my sister and to be quite frank I'm the only one standing strong out of the three of us, but their coming along slowly but surely. I went through so many phases of being angry with my mother when I was younger, and still sometimes now to the day at 27. I feel if marriage and a two parent home wasn't so over rated she would still be living today. Now please don't get me wrong I think marriage is a good thing when it's soley based on love and I hope to one day be married, but at the same time I do not feel less than a women because I'm a single mom and not married. If it was meant for my childs father to marry me than I'm sure we would be married, he definitely bought the engagement ring when we were together 6 yrs ago, but we never made it to that point. I think that so many women actually go insane to be married or stay married even if the relationship is tainted. Is this the reason why we see these particular women acting so viscous and bitter when the marriage doesn't work, so they try and take everything they can take from their spouse, this to me is so "WEAK" and to be quite frank you see more WW behaving like this, and I have no desire keeping up with them. When it is that time for a man who will ask my hand in marriage so be it, but I refuse to be so hung up on marriage to where I'll leave a guy who treats me good, because he has not asked me to marry him yet, this to me is psychotic. I guess I'm one of the few women in the world who is not trying to keep up with other women.
Sandra:
I think a lot of men, particularly BM, are purposely in denial about the effect of their behavior on women and children, not because they don't know, but because they don't want to know or acknowledge reality. Acknowledging reality would force men to confront their behaviors and the consequences thereof, and would likely require a change in much of the self-indulgent and selfish behaviors that so many men exhibit in regard to their treatment of women and children. Men don't want to do this.
My reply:
In previous days, that voice of conscience came from her daddy saying, you do right by my daughter, or you will have to answer to me!
This is a wonderful discussion and the black community really need to get their own house in order. We as a community have no respect for each other at all. Black women have been taught not to value ourselves and I have to say, the religious organisations are to blame to a certain extent. Because of slavery, racism, discrimination, we had to make excuses for unworthy men, if you look at Sean Combs and the others, we look at them because they have money, but we don't not call them what they really are, in many ways I feel these men are worst than prostitutes. We black woman forget that we are made in the image of God, and we are entitled to the very best, marriages, babies, nice homes etc. The media tells us that there is not enough good black men, so we have to settle for less, and we end up bitter, disappointed people. We need to change our mindset of how we feel about ourselves and demand the best and we will get it.
I just wanted to let everyone know that Tyra Bank's show this forthcoming Monday (2/25) is about the State of Black Women in America. THIS SHOULD BE INTERESTING !!!
http://tyrashow.warnerbros.com/
I just wanted to let everyone know that Tyra Bank's show this forthcoming Monday (2/25) is about the State of Black Women in America. THIS SHOULD BE INTERESTING !!!
--------
Knowing Tyra's self-severing-ass it will probably be a show filled with negative statistics. smdh
what time is Tyra's show on, I'm in Boston-so east coast time please?
Tyra Banks? I think she's one of the most annoying talkshow host around. Post your review because I won't be watching LOL.
Anywhoo, I have a question for everyone? What do you think the marriage odds would have been if Lebron had a non-black gf and why?
its just my opinion, but I think he would have broken his neck marrying her. I think he would then have felt she was "good enough" for him...
Sara-T...I feel the same way...He would have married her right outta high school..LOL
I know that all marriages are not made in heaven and I certainly acknowledge that it will be harmful to children to be daily witness to an abusive (physically or mentally) relationship. However, I tend to be somewhat distrustful of the statement and the notion itself that children are always better off if parents who are in a "loveless" relationship divorce - so often this is used by childish and self-indulgent adults as an excuse to do what they want, whatever the real consequences to their children (and their own characters). Who knows what constitutes a "loveless" marriage? I suppose this is a cultural and individual thing, based on your expectations of marriage. If you asked most children, you might be surprised to find out that an overtly "lovey-dovey" or passionate relationship is not what they are looking for in their parents. Lovey-doveyness and passion are what husbands and wives look for in each other, not what children look for in parents. Often children are truly the "last ones to know" in a divorce - they didn't even know that the marital relationship was so "off" that divorce was even under consideration. So I am suspicious when "it's best for the children" is used as an excuse (or one of the excuses) for a divorce, because (absent certain egregious circumstances) IMO this is rarely true. Adults mostly divorce for adult reasons - i.e., what's best for them, regardless of what's truly best for the children. The adults usually just assume that the children will learn to adjust and cope.
Selena said...Anywhoo, I have a question for everyone? What do you think the marriage odds would have been if Lebron had a non-black gf and why?
I think it is less about the race of the woman than about the standards set. The standard or value set in the media for ww and women in general is high, the market is artifically inflated but it is what it is. All other women are taught in the media to set the standard high and make him earn the prize. It is what it is. That does not mean BW should settle for less. It just means it will take longer to achieve the goal if the standard is high - but that will weed out the bad risks, bad apples, those not worthy of the time and effort and who do not appreciate the worth and value of the woman. So set the standard high.
People (men) pursue what it is they desire and or value. If the desire is high enough for what they what they will do whatever it takes i.e. meet the standard established for attaining that which they desire. The key is they will do what is required and no more - it makes sense why do more than is necessary.
For example a person wants a specific car - it has value for them - it is valuable to them. They will ask the price or standard that must be met to get the car. The dealer will state this is the price, they will negotiate - if the price is higher than the person is willing to pay they will walk away; however if they value is such that the price matters less than what they want then they will do what it takes to pay the price. If they can get the car for less they will - but if not and they want it they will pay the asking price.
Lesson learned know the value (i.e. what is important to you and what makes you special - i.e. who you are and what you offer (personality, brains, etc.). Determine the value based on what matters to you - don't let anyone else set the standard.
Determine the value or importance of what you want from the situation and what the level of effort is you are willing to expend to achieve what it is that you desire. Accept that except for food, clothes and shelter you are not lacking - but that you are a whole, healthy person - everything else is extra. How much extra depends on what it is and what it is worth.
Do not give away something of worth i.e. yourself - time, attention, caring etc. for too little in return. Fair exchange is no robbery. If you give in an exchange and expect to get what is asked in return and that does not come to pass - do not continue to give.
Continuing to give in that situation lowers the standard. Once a person learns they can give less and still get - guess what they will give less.
Set the standard high there is room to negotiate - some things are negotiable some are not. Know what the non-negotiables are for yourself based on your values and the value you place on yourself and set the standard. Either the person agrees and meets the standard or they don't and if they don't then - no harm no foul nothing lost.
If a person sees this is the standard they can either decide to meet it or not they may try to negotiate - which is fine - but ultimately the standard is what it is - meet the standard or do not play in this game.
Men understand standards, they understand rules as part of the patriarchal society they make them. They also accept and respect reciprocity and expect to be held to standards. If they are not and they can get away with it they will - it is human nature.
Tom Cruise and Katie are an example - she got preggers before they married (dumb move on her part IMHO) - but she was prepared to walk and take the kid with if he did not come through - moreover her family and friends had her back - so he had no choice but to man up and meet the standard despite the screw up at the start. Lesson learned - Set the standard high from the start and hold the other party accountable. Set the standard and be prepared to walk if it is not met - enforce those consequences.
Never agree to do something i.e. have a man's child if you are not fully prepared or positioned to handle the situation if it does not work out. Protect yourself from the start. Set the tone - do not let others set it for you. It's about self preservation.
If the woman in this situation says this is the standard to be met if you want what you want up front then the man will either accept it or reject it and life goes on.
Women need to set the standard high and start out prepared to walk if they standard is not met. Refuse to give away your worth and value - just to get a man. A man is a man is a man. If this one can't meet the standard set another one will come along - refuse to sell short and take a loss when the supply is plentiful (there many quality men out there) are and the demand is high (quality and value are always sought after).
As a woman you are whole and complete - know that for a fact and act accordingly to set the standard high.
V/r
Clarice
I watched the preview of Monday's Tyra show. Unfortunately I think it will just be another hour of stereotypes and a sob story about the sorry state BW are currently in. I don't know about you but I don't like clinging around negativity because I feel that it destroys your initiative.
Anywhoo I'm starting to think that Tyra is a shill for the white media. Doesn't care how BW look to the world as long as she gets paid.
http://zabethblog.blogspot.com/
wow, zabeth! that was great insight. that's exactly why I stopped watching her show. especially after she had that show which nobody picked the sista. (which i thought was fake BTW)
To Eric,
Believe me, she would much rather be married to LeBron James. I saw her on the Oprah show and she comes across as a polished, more bourgeise, old fashioned type of black woman not a baby mama. Now if they married and the marriage did not work out thats another story. Trust me, that girl would rather have the things that Sara spoke about. The only reason that she is hanging around waiting is because this boy is worth so much. Black men treat black women like they are just not worthy. But then again, she is allowing it to happen. He is young and rich and therefore he is not ready to marry. He wants to have his fun.
But imagine...if he looked like that and had that kind of woman and was a blue collar laborer, he would have married her years ago. Now that he has money and fame a woman like that is a dime a dozen for him.
Jaz,
I agree with you. That is sad about your white friends boyfriend's sister. She has a ghetto mentality...Ghetto girl. And not everyone from the ghetto has a ghetto mentality but it is obvious that that sister did.
There is a great article in the Atlantic, titled "Marry Him". It's about a white woman's regretting having choose to become a single mother and waiting for the perfect man, when there is no such thing. She point out if marriage does end, divorce mothers have it better than most single moms. I agreed with her fully. As a divorced mom my daughters have a intact relationship with their father and his family. He is still in their lives and receive both financial/emotional support from him. Like the authors wrote, I get a couple weekends alone, while single, but never married moms rarely get a break. I see my friends who were baby mamas and they catch hell. The kids never see their father.
I plan to get married again and encourage my daughters to get married. Single parenting without support is too hard and get sends a wrong message to our kids.
Most famous people have been married and honestly, if I had to give up millions of my money I wouldn't want to get married again either. But like others point out, they have finanical stability. Most black single mothers don't. I just have a problem with people who never been married but want to play married producing all these kids.
Society has devolved to where criticism of OOW births is taboo. It is the norm now and celebrated. Hence, the Essence cover. So, let it be.
Getting married, like speaking properly is a "white" thing to do. A number of states consider 3 years plus of cohabitating sorta-like marriage, which gives us the common-law wife. People probably think - why bother with a ceremony?
Opposed to guys, women appear to be ready for children at an earlier age. In the past, he was a man by 18-to-23. Today, he's still a teenager. For a young woman, somehow she's an adult at 16.
As for the effect of Lebron and Sean, they reinforce the negative black breeder stereotype. Sean only wanted to marry J-Lo. If Lebron's girl was white / Latina (like Kobe's wife), I bet they'd be married already.
Last point: marriage isn't about personal happiness with regards to children. Marriage is about family (in-laws especially) and building stable (in theory) societies. And it is a patriarchal system.
...getting off my soapbox...
"I don't agree with babies without marriage, but I certainly understand why halle is reluctant is marry..+ I love her to death so she stays up regardless...."
Taylor-Sara,
I know all about Halle's troubles with dbrbm and I also understand her stance on not marrying again. I think she's fabulous and should remain on your site.
You know what breaks my heart the most? It is whe in black churches, there are a whoooole lot of younger black women with OOW children with no fathers. That's what's breaking my heart. In the black church, there's too much stuff going on that I don't agree with. The black church is too lenient towards fornication, adultery, and homosexuality. I'm not saying that it's not like that in other non-black churches, but the majority of it is in the BLACK CHURCH!!! That's why I'm going to start finding me a church that's more racially divers because let me tell you something from my experience. If you as a black woman want to get married, the black church is NOT the place for you. Trust me. I know. The black church, to me is not helping black women at ALL. There's more black women in the church than black men. If you want to find love outside your race, you can'tt do it in the black church. I'm ot saying go to church to find a man. You should be going to church for worship, but as far as you wanting to get married, the black church is not the place.
I just want to throw that there.
Thank you
Nicole, you are so right! the church I stopped going to, only focused on collection plates and talking about how women should be submissive to men. Men who were not even thinking about heading anyone's household. what a joke. The women all gobbled up every word the pastor said, and no one seemed to notice with all the struggling single mothers in this church, the pastor drives a bentley! not a mercedes but a Bentley! you know the kind that cost 200.000 and up!!!
Unfortunately I watched about 10-15mins of the show-something that I said I wouldn't do. I hated it. Couldn't they have picked bw who don’t give a damn about who bm date? Where were the women that DO date quality non-bm. I'm telling you...this "We hate ww because they are dating "our" men is getting tired. With the small exception of high profile celebrities, I have yet to see a bm of HIGH QUALITY with a ww.
If Tyra wants to talk about the state of bw, where are the sistas who have embraced their natural hair? Where are the stories about the second revolution of "nappy" hair wearers? Where are the stories about the new explosion of wm/bw relationships?
It seems that Tyra is the new "Oprah" in showing POSITIVE images *sarcastically* about bm and bw. How many times can one woman complain about the "industry” and its obsession with weave- all the while walking around looking like Blackpunzel. We know she's from Long Beach but damn why does she promote every stereotype in the book?
Tyra you get the first “Girl sit down and really STFU because you have no real substance" black media award LOL.
I could not agree more. And she used to say the modeling industry forced her to wear weave, well she stopped modeling about 4-5 years ago and her weaves are bigger and longer and more eye catching than ever!
To Selena:
Tyra says she reads all her emails personally and responds in person. Email her and see what says.
I agree, I think bp should be married before having kids that's why our race is in such a horrible state now, (no fathers around) I also am proud of you for standing up the the mammy-bunch above. they are the same troublemakers from C1s blog. when he told them they could not use his blog to start mess anymore, they lost interest in his blog. Basically everybody thinks their just trash but they don't know it....
Chloe said
To Selena:
Tyra says she reads all her emails personally and responds in person. Email her and see what says.
I posted this on her chat blog concerning that particular show. Maybe I will try to email her directly. Funny thing is I saw a couple of messages from other women expressing their disappointment as well.
I don't see a problem with Halle Berry being up here because Halle has her OWN money. She is probably richer than her model boyfriend.
But I can't believe Kid Rock is on here. What? That guy is a LOSER. He has a biracial son - he didn't ever marry that child's mother. But he married Pamela Lee for no apparent reason (without even bothering to tell his gf at the time). And then they divorced about two seconds later. Now he has another black gf (Conchita), who he's been with before, but broke up with in the past. He started calling her right after he and Pamela Lee broke up.
Kid Rock is not a "quality" man imo - not even in the same league as most of the wm on this site.
BTW (I know too much about celebrities), George Lucas and his gf Mellody have only been seen together starting in 2007, so I'm not sure if they are "longtime."
Also, Prince Albert's son - unlike Prince Maximillian - will never ascend to the throne; he is "illegitimate." Prince Albert has never married. He has another illegit child that he only acknowledged when she was 14.
Kid rock is not being viewed so much for his 'quality' but rather as an example of a rich wm who dates bw and nothing more. I really don't know too many sistas who want him-do you?
As for Prince Albert's little son -he is still an heir, he will not inherit the thone but he def. will inherit alot of his daddy's money...
We as black women need to look out for ourselves and stop settling for less. I was watching Tyra on YouTube, and I couldn't believe it. They should've at least show one BW/WM married couple. I mean, in my honest opinion, I think that it's stereotypical, especially when it comes to interracial dating. They make it seem like we are jealous of white women or something. They make it seem like we are very angry at the white women who are marrying black men. I'm GLAD that they're doing it. It will give us a break for a change. BM has cause too much harm in our lives. They are showing the world through the internet, the media, the music, and the magazines that they hate us. We need to let the DBR black men GO! I don't hate black men because I'm saved and I don't want to have any hate in my heart, but I HATE the things that they put black women through. They treat us like we're their enemy or something. I'm through with them. They have TOO many issues. I'm going to get myself together spiritually, mentally, emotionally, and physically. We as black women need to take care of ourselves. We need to build our self esteem. We need to fight for our identity. We have to declare that we are NOT going to be 2nd choice, we are NOT going to be seen as inferior, we are NOT going to be used as someone to screw, but not to marry. I mean, that's basically what this is about anyway. Black women, we deserve better. We deserve more than just being sperm donors and baby mamas. We don't have to settle for less just to have somebody. Love yourself, and love will find you. Just open your heart.
One Love
I'm not sure why tyra does this. I just never understood! Tyra is beautiful, intelligent, has a great personality and her career is red hot, yet it seems she purposely likes to put bw in a bad light! I just could not tell you why but I have certainly noticed. Her show always makes us look jealous, mean and secondary! I just don't watch anymore.....
I watched the Tyra Banks show on Monday and I too was disppointed by her and the bw on the show. Tyra and the other bw for the most part just allowed the bm on the panel to crap all over them while they made no real attempt to defend themselves. I dont understand why bm where even on the show(once again its being reinforced that what bm think of us is everything).
If I were in the audience I would have stood up and said I dont give a damn about bm and who they date who they marry or what they think of us because I dont want them anyway(and give a long list of reasons too, with no malice in my voice and then I would just calmly take my seat in the audience with a big smile on my face).
It was the same old program with bw screaming about how their taking "our men" (always embrassing for me to hear bw saying that on network television)there is no "our men". I would love to see the day when bm are shouting their taking "our women" and where was the mention of bw exploring the option of "dating out".
It was just embrassing and bm can go f@#k themselves.
I agree about the Tyra show issue. I stopped watching her show because she did not seem as "real" after her first 2 seasons. Her "model" show is even a contradiction if you ask me. She sat their on stage and cried because women were accusing her of having breast implants (she even had a doctor do a sonogram on stage to prove she had real breasts) -- I recently saw a preview where she had all the audience members, including herself, take off their pants to show their natural shapes! I think that was another stab at the media in response to the photos of her in a bathing suit which were not so fashion modelesque. I know that she does not have a "Black" show, but shows about dating, marriage, etc. should involve the spectrum of races...she knows (probably even has friends) who are in IR relationships, but my guess is that her producers don't want to go that route.
But she never seems to have shows depicting BW in a positive light. So, I suppose this latest show was just another sucker punch to BW! Has she no clue? Tyra herself dated a WM (tall, Italian, basketball player) -- it's like she's afraid to "go there" in a positive way on her show. She is just a puppet. I must say the same about Oprah...it's as if their cause, their shows/platform still is used to elevate WW! When Oprah had a show about IR relationships, she asked questions like how is the sex, how is the dancing, what about hair issues? What??? So, Oprah really doesn't go there either...and I'd rather she not, if it will depict us as angry at WW! This media cover-up shows me that this is jealousy based against BW -- has to be.
Meli
I think it's big business to denigrate black women in the media. How else could you explain the popularity of Flavor of Love, I love NY, vile hip-hop videos, Maury, and certain court reality programs. The Tyra Show simply follows the money. I've never been a fan of Tyra Banks, I've always thought of her as disingenuous and showy. She's not a worthy successor to Oprah.
I've addressed Kid Rock on my blog as well- the purpose to simply show that he is a wealthy WM who dates ALL kinds of women- dysfunctional women in particular. All of his current and former flames have been f-ed up in some way. His son's mother lied to him about the paternity of her second child and he accuses serial divorcee Pam Anderson of faking a pregnancy. He's not picking quality women here either. Moreover, his half black son will inherit some if not all of his wealth. Therefore money will be recycled back into the Black community- this rarely happens when BM marry WW.
IMHO, it is ironic to be critical of Kid Rock but then praise Halle Berry. As much as we may love Halle, as much as we may understand her reasons for not wanting to marry again, and as much as we may try to sugarcoat things, SHE IS STILL GABRIEL'S BABY'S MAMA. It doesn't matter how much money she has, that is still the type of situation we are trying to steer other BW away from.
http://zabethblog.blogspot.com/
I recently overheard my shacked up neighbors arguing. They are two DBR black people with a 1 year old baby. He's an abusive cheater, and she's a needy alcoholic.
She discovered his latest jump off when she heard the voice mail. It was the most depressing thing to overhear him tell her he wants her to get out, and she cries and whines "but I'm your baby mama" as if that has ANY meaning. She won't buy a clue and move on to raise the baby. I shake my head whenever I see the baby. These two are hopelessly damaged. Poor baby.
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